Dhimmi ? Dummy ? Thinker ! Britain III

rodin_thinker_detail.jpgThis was sitting in the filter. I had hemmed and hawed about posting it. In light of a post I’ll rack up later this week I thought I might as well post it. My decision was motivated by the blogosphere being all a gaga over the “poll” that vast majority of Europeans feel threatened by Muslims/Muslim immigration. The “poll” as splashed on the pages of the UK’s Express fails to mention that the former Archbishop is both former as well as not really the author. The full report presented by the world economic folks at Davos will be used for the following post.

Anyway this article was thought provoking since it hit the logic pathways in the ole brain. Read it or at least the following excerpt.

The following is an excerpt from this article.

The fact is that Muslims in Britain are citizens of this country. We are no longer migrants in a Land of Unbelief.

For my generation, we were born here, raised here, schooled here, we work here and we’ll stay here.

But more than that, on a historically unprecedented scale, Muslims in Britain have been allowed to assert their religious identity through clothing, the construction of mosques, the building of cemeteries and equal rights in law.

However, it isn’t enough for responsible Muslims to say that, because they feel at home in Britain, they can simply ignore those passages of the Koran which instruct on killing unbelievers.

Because so many in the Muslim community refuse to challenge centuries-old theological arguments, the tensions between Islamic theology and the modern world grow larger every day.

I believe that the issue of terrorism can be easily demystified if Muslims and non-Muslims start openly to discuss the ideas that fuel terrorism.

Crucially, the Muslim community in Britain must slap itself awake from its state of denial and realise there is no shame in admitting the extremism within our families, communities and worldwide co-religionists.

If our country is going to take on radicals and violent extremists, Muslim scholars must go back to the books and come forward with a refashioned set of rules and a revised understanding of the rights and responsibilities of Muslims whose homes and souls are firmly planted in what I’d like to term the Land of Co-existence.

And when this new theological territory is opened up, Western Muslims will be able to liberate themselves from defunct models of the world, rewrite the rules of interaction and perhaps we will discover that the concept of killing in the name of Islam is no more than an anachronism.

Previous DDT Britain posts here and here



  1. jonolan says:

    But for some reason the supposedly moderate Muslims rarely seem to stand up and denounce their own extremists. There’s comes a point when the lack of outrage equates to approval…

  2. BDE says:


    How many moderate Jews and Christians do you see denouncing their own extremists?

  3. in2thefray says:

    @Jonolan: There are a couple schools of thought here. Let’s get the easiest up and out of the way. The “moderates” lack of public outcry is at times deafening. On that I thought this article spoke to it.I will say this though,it isn’t completely lacking. There are at least some suppositions though. Is it the moderates we want ? The Koranists,for what I understand thus far may be a better way to go. Focused on the pillars as opposed to fatwas and hadiths.
    @BDE I think it applies to all faiths but w/ the Abrahamic for this argument. There are many ways the mainstream of any given faith comment,denounce otherwise deal with the actions of those that bring turmoil to the faith and humanity at large.

  4. jonolan says:


    I see a fair number of Christians denouncing their own extremists. Truth be told, I don’t see a similar pattern amongst the Jews, so you may have a point there. 😦


    You’re right, outcry among Muslims who do not favor violent jihad or creation of the Caliphate by force is not totally lacking, but it is seemingly rare and muted.

    I would favor the Qur’anists since the haddith are the root of many of the problems we’re experiencing. Also, from a theological point of view, the hadith are not scripture – just the interpretations of Mohamed (pbuh), who is shown in haddith themselves to be fallible.

  5. Free to think, free to believe... says:

    One of the problems with muslims [in the uk] who wish to make a protest about ‘their’ extremists is that they may well have family back ‘in the old country’ to give it that american-irish twist… I was a member of the [you’re going to love this Fray] Crusaders when it was a christian organization for university students et al… [They have now, rather wimpishly I think, renamed themselves] and they had a rally where they were asking muslims to sign a petition about human rights in islamic countries – many wanted to but were afriad that their government might read the names and find the families…

    Jews who denounce their extremists are often dismissed as ‘selling out Israel’ but they do rally every now and then in Jerusalem and Tel Aviv – it’s easier for them to repel the criticism when they live there than in someplace else…

    As you’ve posted a piece from the ‘Daily Mail’ a notoriously biased paper regarding the migrant/immigrant thing I look forward to what you have to say, InToTheFray.

  6. in2thefray says:

    I agree with the line of thinking you present. It is supported by the episodes in British neighborhoods where converts (apostates) were terrorized. Police investigations revealed little,mmm just like in gang infested hoods in the States ? Yes. People can be too afraid to talk and for good reasons.
    As for the Mail and it’s bias. I don’t judge the papers positions quite simply since I don’t have daily time with them. Is it safe to assume the Mail is biased towards the anti side ? I’ve noticed they are pretty consistent in reporting on the Muslim issue. I give them credit though that they seem to actually do some journalism as opposed to the Express and offer bits others can mull over. The above article was selected not due to the paper but the articles content.
    Urban Saints ?

  7. Free to think, free to believe... says:

    Yes, the Daily Mail does use more words than The Sun and a good few others…

    Over here, we kind of inculcate which newspapers have such and such a bias… I remember doing a study in the late 80′ for my English class of comparing newspapers for their bias. The Times came out as the most biased but also more unlikely to be seen as that as it used lots of detail/facts – it just filtered them all rather rigorously…

    The Daily Mail is one of the ‘scaremongers’ of the middle classes. As is the Express…

    One thing I think we have to understand – just like some neighbourhoods in the states is that the police do not, how shall we say, treat the folk therein with as much respect as they might… and so a siege mentality can leach in…

    There was a wonderful moment in a trial when a young, um, ‘scallywag’ was ‘booked’ by a policeman who said he would write ‘everything up nice and proper’ only to have to listen to himself as he was caught by the scallywag’s microphone and replayed in court!

    Needless to say, if you have to say you’re going to ‘write everything up nice and proper’ you know you aren’t acting that way.

    But, to get back to it – most of the reports are coming back and saying that there is a ‘greater perceived threat’ or the like and the Daily Mail is part of that machine.

  8. jonolan says:

    Ah yes, but when a media outlet’s bias is shown primarily by what it chooses to report on, as opposed to shading the substance of what it reports, is that so bad?

  9. Free to think, free to believe... says:

    Because Jonolan when a media outlet decides what it’s going to report on it also then decides HOW it’s going to report that with regards to its ‘editorial’ stance on whatever it is that they choose to report…

    If only journalists could write down stuff as they see it and then have a paper print it…

    Over here [talking about perceptions] a survey showed that most folk thought 80% of crime was committed by youngsters – let’s say under 20s unless you want me to go check… when 16% of crime is – the Daily Mail et al are largely responsible for feeding this climate of self-made fear.

    InToTheFray – talking about how Britain is bending over backwards for Islam/muslims – are you aware that any[read all] arranged/forced marriages are given instant divorce as soon as a complaint goes through the court systems…

    This is a real cultural plank of hindu/muslim societies and can ‘benefit’ both families eg members of a family make it over to a western country [take the UK for example] and they have a daughter – the family back home could arrange for a marriage to another family which, previously, was out of ‘social’ reach… Thereby both families ‘benefit’ – one has a son in the UK and the other has links to a more influential family…

    Personally, I’d like to see it deemed ‘annulled with compensation’ rather than divorce but that’s mere quibbling.

    How this effects the communities in years to come will be interesting and I would anticipate that the authority of the family as left behind may diminish. But if it’s not enforced it will of course mean nothing.

  10. moinansari says:

    Thank you for your comments on my site. I appreciate it. I agree with you and will continue to enjoy visiting your blog also.

    I particularly enjoyed your comments on Islamphobia, but disagree with Willima that the the “Shah will eventually win in iran”. The Shah himself was an imported meteorite that shined for a few days dancing to the music of the puppeteers.

    The democractic movement of Iran got hijacked..A more normal state of affairs for Iran would probably be pre-shah, or the brief interlude of Moddesdegh. Evn though the time was short but it reflected genuine Iranin aspirations.


    You may also enjoy these posts.


    Your comment on India getting a free pass is very true. India, South Africa, Brazil, Argentina and Israel never faced sanctions for their nuclear programs…only Pakistan did

    Invoice for Defeating terror, Securing Pakistani Nukes $150 Billion per annum

    Kissinger and other Americans threatened Pakistan

    The Taliban was a construct of the CIA. Rohrbarker

    Geert Wilders: Muslims support 10 point plan to Stop Islamaization of Europe

    Python swallows alligator and explodes: Lessons from the Peloponnesian War.

    Is “India” is a failed state? After 60 years 560 states could not be put together as a “nation”

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